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Viestiketju: Milos Sarcevin reenijuomat

  1. #21
    Anssi Manninen:n käyttäjäkuva
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    Kreatiinimono on nesteessä varsin kauan stabiili.
    DOMINUS NUTRITION OY
    www.dominusnutrition.fi

  2. #22
    Blaster:n käyttäjäkuva
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    Lainaa Alkuperäinen lähettäjä Usva Lue viesti
    vaikka lääkepuoli ton jutun perusteella onkin vähän hapuillu
    Hhhm en oikein ymmärrä mitä tarkoitat.
    Yleensä juuri nuo nesteenpoistoaineet ja insuliini on niitä vaarallisimpia aineita ton kaliiberin heppujen "normaalikäytössäkin".
    Mm Mustafa oli niitä aikoja dietillä melko huonossa hapessa kun kävi "karsinnoissa" Olympiakisaan, hillu salinsa respassa kuin living death - makaili jossain nurkassa ja sano vaimealla äänellä, että jätä kausikortti vaan pöydälle ja mee treenaamaan. Sitten DY:n järkkäämissä kisoissa sijoittumalla pääsi Olympiaan mukaan. Selitti mulle, että tää laji on sellaista jatkuvaa kuolemalla leikkimistä - kisaa edeltävänä yönä hänellä aina istuu avustaja sängyn vierällä tarkkailemassa hengittääkö hän nukkuessaan. Kyseisenä iltana soitti vaimolleen hotlasta, jolloin vaimo kysyi heti onko hän yksin huoneessa, no oli ja vaimo kielsi käymästä punkalle makuulle ennen kuin avustaja saapuu. No Musti nukahti kuitenkin puhelun jälkeen ja oli varma käyneensä tuolla puolen, koska kaikki kivut katosi...sitten siivooja pelasti hänet aamulla, ravisteli tämän hereille ja sano, että bussissa porukka oottanut jo pitkään. No Musti virkosi siitä ja pyysi siivoojan kantamaan laukun dösään, itsellä ei ollut voimaa nostaa snadia kassia lattialta...

    Milos meni sitten vielä korottamaan Mustin annoksia ja muutenkin äijä oli liian löysässä kunnossa = mm nesteinen ja yliladattu, joten Milosin preppaus meni pahasti perseelleen.

    Uskoisin, että Milos on halpa ja todellinen valmentamisen taso on sitä samaa kuin normi Yugoilla, vähän kaikissa hommissa mihin ne sormensa työntää. Näillä kulmilla niitäkin tuttavuuksia on riittänyt siivoojista, rekkakuskeista aina kv tason liikemiehiin ja firmojen omistajiin... tarkemmin en viitti sanoa mikä se taso onn.

  3. #23

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    shakerissa palkkari on sen viis sekkaa, mutta reenijuoma koko reenin ajan kun sitä pikkuhiljaa tissuttelen ja jos pohja lähestyy niin laimennan vedellä.

    milos kommentilla tarkotin sitä että oma käsitys on että se ehkä reenistä tietää, mutta noi insuliini yms jutut vetäny perseelleen. mutta miestä en sen paremmin tunne joten turha mun sanoa mitään lääke puolella tarkotin tosiaan noita insuliini kömmähdyksiä yms.

    hyvä tietää tuo monohydraatin stabiilius. kiitokset harhaluuloni korjaamisesta.

  4. #24
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    Lainaa Alkuperäinen lähettäjä Ruxi Lue viesti
    Sarcev osaa kyllä treeni- ja ravintojutut hyvin. Ei turhaan ole esim. kysytty treenivalmentaja.

  5. #25
    LoCo:n käyttäjäkuva
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    Mitä muuta lie ottanut ennen punttia?

  6. #26
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  7. Peukutukset:


  8. #27
    cuck jumal velho:n käyttäjäkuva
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    Does anyone know from experience how Milos dials people in for shows? I hear he uses insulin with the precontest diets. Any thoughts will be appreciated. And also....how does one go about consulting with him...also the price?

    Gearge Farah:
    Dude ,why you need to get help from someone that never got any good rep about diet and prep. Name one person that worked with Milos and looked *good. With all do respect for the guy he is great pro etc.. But I don't like the way the peole that work with him look on the game day. But hey this is only my opinion.

    Chad Nichols
    Guys! Enough is enough! Joe Weider once told me "never to get into a farting contest with a skunk!" - so drop it! To put an end to the question and hopefully the back and forth bashing, I've said numerous times on here already, that my beliefs are different than Milos', so I'm not going to make comments on his beliefs. All I want to say is that my way works for me and he believes that his way works for him.

    I started this board for individuals who are interested in learning the views of myself, my athletes and the professionals that I associate with. We also have a lot of great guys and gals who have joined the board with great minds and a lot of great points of view. Take in as much of it as you can and see if you can apply any of it to you!

    Chad-
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Well I had contacted Milos once or twice. He wanted $4000 to work with me for about 6 months. He promised 30-40 lbs in the way of contest weight, and yes, he wrote me a huge infromative on insulin as I told him I was skeptical of it. He stated that NOT using insulin when you have a large intake of simple and complex carbs after a workout risks you becoming insulin dependant more so than using it. This statement kinda threw me, and coupled with the ridiculous price he put out there, we quickly ceased conversing.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Milos is trying to make a living just like Chad is. He sells his theories, Chad sells his. Personally i would take Chads advice any day

    If only Dennis James would stop working with Milos and taking his advice. I thought he had a huge future as a amateur, but the last few years have seen him lose it. Dont get me wrong, i am a DJ fan and i hope he wakes up one morning and decides to stop taking the advice of Milos. DJ will be better for the outing
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Milos:
    Well, as it was brought to my attention that few people talked about me I had to join discussion board.
    At least nobody would need to guess if this is really me.
    Now, let me first say that I am here to YES, possibly learn something!
    I would never stop learning. I have no ego and I would take advice from everyone IF it makes sense!
    So, for people that claim that I am talking negatively about Chad here is a challenge, have a courage and introduce yourself and than say exactly what I said!

    Only thing that I would always say about him is –his results speak for themselves.
    Ronnie, Chris, Flex, Kim, Linda, Nasser just to name the few!
    I think I would make myself look quite stupid if I would try to argue his expertise.

    On the same note, the only thing that I was saying to everyone about Chad is that before I explained him how to use Insulin (Ottawa 1995) he never used it!
    I would emphasize only that. Chuck Sanow personally asked me if I would tell Chad correct way of using it, and I did!

    Now, does he use insulin in contest prep of many athletes I am not going to debate?
    He actually helped me for 1999 Mr. Olympia and I pretty much know his methods –that are actually not much different than mine, like someone said.

    But, that is not the reason I am responding.
    I am quite secure with myself as a person, father, husband, bodybuilder, nutritionist, trainer or whatever else.
    Some comments here were just out of line, but there is nothing I could do to stop them.
    Actually I am quite surprised that rumors are not worse.

    As far as my bodybuilding accomplishments, I can only say that I do have absolutely the worse record of all IFBB pro champions. I won only one out of 70 shows that I entered. Now, as that show was second class show, I might mention that Chris Cormier took third at that show. But, how many people have IFBB pro title?
    Me coming from Yugoslavia has really very little to do with qualifying for the Olympia for 10 consecutive years and managing to beat champions like Paris, Gaspari, Bannout, Backles, Makkawy, Levrone, Colleman, Cormier, El Sonbaty, Taylors, Priest, Burke, James, Cutler, Jackson, Schilerkamp, Benaziza, Schmidt, Pastel, Cottrell etc

    As far as me trying to do what Chad does, I want to clarify one thing.
    I was helping NUMEROUS top professionals (names are on my web site) without ANY financial arrangements. First guy that actually paid me is Eddie and that was at the point that I had to do something about it, as I had no time for anything else.
    So if you think I am making a business from it, ask the athletes.
    Since than I did inquire some of the clients, amateur bodybuilders and I did not get any complains so far.

    And for George, I respect your opinion. You are entitled to one, but why did you gave me your card and told me that you would like to work with me?

    For me being a lesser man and having no backbone, I might just say I do not go through life making enemies. Instead I am always trying to make friends.
    But, for those that want to challenge me in any way including physically, I can be found every day at my gym in Fullerton.
    1101 South Placentia avenue, Fullerton CA 92592, phone 714/680-8881

    And for some of the guys that have to hide behind login names, and I do believe I know who he is – why do you always chicken out when you see me in person?


    Chad Nichols
    First off, I'm glad Milos came on the board and responded. *If you would read the posts I have posted having anything to do with Milos, I have always said that I liked him as a person - and above, you can also read that all I said was he has his ways and I have mine -

    I don't necessarily believe in some of his methods - but I'm sure there are some of mine that he doesn't believe in as well. *

    As far as him speaking with me about the insulin - absolutely - I already posted that we spoke in '95 about it - and I also stated that I spoke to several people *including doctors that year about the same thing. *In all actuality I had spoken with 2 other individuals prior to speaking with Milos. *A good nutritionist who is on top of his game gets as much info on a subject and researches it as much as possible - and that's what I did. *I took everything Milos said in on that day, as well as I did with the info of the other individuals I had spoken to both before and after I met with Milos. *I have also stated that the only thing I agree with pertaining to Milos' insulin theory is the time frame on when to eat after taking the insulin. *Everything else I do is different - so why are we still discussing this?

    Milos, I hope you aren't implying that I am the one posting negative comments about you; hiding behind a screen name. Anyone who knows me - pretty much knows that if I have a problem with you - I'm gonna let you know about it. I don't hide behind a screen name. If you are not implying that you think it is me - then reply to that person on here - we have no problems posting it. Put his name on here and we will confront him, I don't care who you think it is.

    Since the Olympia, there probably hasn't been one day go by where I haven't gotten an e-mail, a call or heard that you have been saying things about me. Do I believe all of them, no. I'm sure some is true some is not, but I've been in the sport long enough to let it roll off. I'm secure enough about who I am, what I do and my accomplishments that I don't care what people think about me.
    I personally felt that you and I had gotten along and I don't personally have a problem with you, as I have stated above. Me and Kim have always been friendly to you and your wife, no matter how you feel about us.

    Just so you know, you are always welcome to post on the board - it would be great to have your comments on here. You can post what you want, whether you agree with my theories or not. --But for all the patrons on the board, I want you all to know that this is NOT going to be a CHAD vs. MILOS debate - like I've said many times - different people have different opinions and theories - so pitting us against one another is going to help no one -and that is what we are here for - helping you - not getting into arguments.

    Everyone just needs to take the info - whether it be mine, someone elses, or a combination of a little of everything and find what works for you.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Milos
    Hi Chad. Thank you for taking the time and responding to my post.
    Right away I would like to make it clear, I was never implying that you are the one hiding behind login name. It is YOUR website after all!
    And as I have no problem telling the truth and telling people in their face what I think of them. I was implying to the only IFBB professional I have a problem with and that is Ms. Shari Kamali!
    I learned from my parents that if I have nothing positive to say about the person I better not say anything at all, but in this instance I would make exception.
    I run into this guy several times before and every time when I would approach his group he would turn around and avoid noticing me. After his pro debut at 2001 Ironman he was scheduled to do photo shoot in my gym, and I made an effort to introduce myself, welcomed him to my gym and congratulated him on Olympia qualification. He was there with Bob, whom I respect a great deal.
    I told him right away that it is none of my business what he does in his private life, but I respectfully told him that as a veteran of the sport I would suggest him to change his attitude as he was pissing off to many people (and some of my personal friends).
    I told him that nice word could open doors of steel, and bad word could close every single one of them. As he just started his career my opinion was that if he makes immediate change he could MAYBE get somewhere.
    He assured me that he is quite a nice guy and everything I hear is just a rumor.
    However, I already had more facts that he expected me to know about it and I pointed out problems he had with my close friends Dennis and Melvin, and what I have heard from several other pros.
    Anyway, I do not want to bore everyone to tears; I was broadcasting Mr. Olympia 2001 live on the Internet and when I was asked what I think of him I told exactly what I think of him.
    I do not respect or like him as a person (numerous reasons) and I think he is pathetic bodybuilder with absolutely nothing on his entire body. Only thing worth mentioning was his conditioning (thank to Chad) and only on first two pro shows he entered!
    Also I was asked what I think of his posing routine and I said –entertaining for the audience but hitting 7 poses in as many minutes would not place him high on qualified IFBB judges list. However, I remember very well I finished with –love him or hate him but he did a good job!
    Next thing I know some of my friends were telling me to go on his web site and read what he said about me. And he pretty much challenged me, telling me that I am on his list, that I am hiding behind a cameras and he would certainly make me cry like a little ***** (his words).
    So I had to answear him (I can post that letter as well) and accepted ANY challenge, ANY time and ANY place. He did not respond.
    Than I saw him at the Arnold, but he managed to walk fast enough so I could not confront him (I was already in the cast). Luckily, I catch him at the airport with his girlfriend at the time and as I excuse myself to the lady I told her loudly that I apologize BUT I have to talk to this arrogant not a very nice person, pointing at him!
    I told him again what I think of him and it was not pretty! I told him that cameras are gone and I want to see him how he is going to make me cry like a little…
    He could not even look at my direction. Real stand up guy, and his girlfriend Bethany was there (later she told me that he is so insecure about himself that he just does things as a cure for all his insecurities, which makes sense).
    Finally, after he got a gift at this years Olympia placing 17th (I had him next to last) he come to my gym again. Class act that he is (NOT), passed by me and my wife (owners of the gym) like we were not even there. Next day he did the same.
    As he is Weider athlete I did not throw him out.
    I have no respect for the man, and that is final thing I am going to say about him, besides that his challenge would always be greatly appreciated and accepted.
    Sorry, I just had to explain everything as even Chad thought that I might be talking about him.
    And Chad, just like you said I thought that I was also respectful, kind and courteous towards you and Kim. I think World of Kim as she was always so sweet and genuine.
    I hear rumors as well as what you supposedly think and talk about me, but I know better how things in our industry are.
    I would like to tell you that IF anyone EVER had said that I was speaking badly about you I would like both of us to face that person.
    I would never hide, and I always stand behind my actions.
    Now, this post is really not what I wanted to discuss with you, but I just had to put the end on this insecure loud mouth. He can talk all he wants. I think Bethany is right about him curing himself with all the fantasies he comes up with.
    I would certainly address another post directly to you Chad, I just wanted to insure you that I was not implying that you are hiding (real man does not) behind the login names.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Chad:

    Milos - thanks for the post.

    After reading your previous post a few times, I realized who you were talking about. I also realize that you and King don't get along. A lot of people just don't understand him. I've known him for about 5-6 years now and have always gotten along with him great - however it's different for me as you are a fellow competitor and I'm not, so I can see how he would stir the pot with you - the feeling of competition.

    I'm not sure, in all honesty, how this whole thing got started. King has never said anything bad to me about you - but then again I don't really talk to him about other athletes - we just b.s. with each other and get to business.

    I do like it that you are a stand up guy and posted your true feelings, whether other people like that or not, I respect it.

    Like I said before - you are always welcome here - and I think the members would be interested in what you have to say. I think this site will continue to grow - it's only been up for two weeks now and we've already got a lot of the pros over here and a lot of great knowledge.

    I wish you luck at the GNC with your guys. I actually thought Titus was the best he has ever been at the Olympia.

    See ya in New Orleans,

    Chad-

  9. #28
    cuck jumal velho:n käyttäjäkuva
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    Milos:
    As I am fired up let me continue.
    I mentioned it to several people that back in 1995 I did tell you my view on correct use of specific insulins for athletic purpose. This is what many people turn around and possibly interpret to you as Milos is talking behind your back.
    Now, I must tell you that at the time when we were discussing about the insulin you told me that you had no knowledge or experiences of how could insulin be taken safely and effectively. You never mentioned any doctors input as I was spending quite a bit of time explaining onset, peak action, duration, critical times, curves, types of insulin, types of simple and complex carbs, timing etc.
    I told you that everyone in my family is a doctor (except me, black sheep) and that I examined for several years how to safely use insulin as anabolic agent.
    I talked to numerous doctors Worldwide and none of them were comfortable telling me how can athletes use it and benefit from it.
    Only when I painfully (numerous hypoglycemic episodes) found out for myself how can insulin be used several doctors told me that this might work.
    My sister (surgeon) also agreed with me that logic behind my program was quite good and endocrinologists and internal medicine specialists told me that they would like to know more about it. So I kept them informed.
    Than Muscle Media 2000 published my (Bill Phillips took the credit, and I still have original article to prove it) article and soon everyone was talking about it.
    Tell me when was the first time you have seen 10 grams of carbs per unit of insulin recommendations in medical books or diabetic society?
    I challenge medical community to show me how they come up with that number!?
    I come up with that number and even thought it is not most accurate (I can elaborate on differences) nobody was using that kind of measurement or scale.
    Look at diabetic books now and you will see what is accepted.
    I even conducted study with insulin diabetic patient on insulin pump that doctors could not stabilize – and using my exact recommendations he is doing great now.
    But, as I am already opening can of warms let’s speak frankly!
    You say you don’t necessarily believe in my methods and the only thing you agree with me is time frame.
    I did explain to you every aspect that I knew at the time and I presented to the World (through MM 2000) and also to many pro bodybuilders and trainers!
    Can you tell me (us) what is different and WHY in your program?
    I try to help numerous athletes (not just bodybuilders) and all the visitors of my website or my gym can confirm (you can too) that I offer FREE help to all with intentions to educate everyone in important subjects regarding sports.
    One of the athletes that you also helped told me that I gave him $100000.00 information
    and he did not spend a dime for it. If I can only count how many people I have helped to actually beat me in the contest –people would laugh.
    But, I believe in sharing the knowledge and as far as sporting events –let’s all have same conditions and than see who is a better athlete!
    I could of kept my secret but I decided to share it.
    I would love to see open discussion here or on any other site.
    Mauro Di Pasqualle, John Berrardi, Lonnie Lowery, Rob Rakowski, Eric Serano, Scott Abel, Chris Aceto are all the experts I would love to see included. I correspond with many of them and it would be great to see what can we come up with.
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Chad:
    I will answer every question that you have targeted in this post. However, I won't lay out my entire insulin plan, as this is what I am using with my athletes and since this is how I make my living - my athletes are paying for this information, and I feel it would be a betrayal to them to give everything away. However, I know that you have spoken to my athletes before about things and you know that there are several differences in how we do things. And I will touch on several of them.

    First topic is the Muscle Media 2000 article. Just so you know, I was told by Dan Duchaine, himself, that HE in fact wrote the MM2000 article and that he was the one that had advised you on the insulin plan. Now, I'm just telling you what HE told me -and unfortunately, we can't ask him - since he is deceased. But he told me, I believe in 1999 - at the ISS/Europa booth (they were a combined booth), he was selling his book there. It was the first time I had met him in person and one of the few times I had talked to him. He told me that basically he and Mike Zumpano (Champion Nutrition) together had come up with those theories. However, I will give you that the article was basically the exact plan you had discussed with me. And I even mentioned this in a previous post, but I believe that I had maybe inferred that you had gotten the info from Dan or MM2000.

    I'm not saying that you didn't write the article, in fact I'm sure there is probably a pretty good chance that you did write it.

    As far as me not telling you that I had spoken with anyone else at that time, I absolutely didn't tell you - as I wanted to hear everything you had to say - I believe I even had you write things down. I did this so that I could compare notes with the other things I had written down. I spoke with 2 other poeple after you - and told them the same - I didn't know about the insulin, as I wanted to make certain I received complete information - not them asking me questions - I wanted to learn from them.

    The one thing that I think we are pretty close on is the time frame of when to eat after the insulin. However, I know that you recommend 10 grams, while I recommend 15 grams. I also think that you recommend 1 large meal to cover the insulin - while I recommend 2 meals - 1 large and 1 small both spaced out at different times. Not a big deal, but it is a significant difference. As well, I know you recommend using both N and R - I don't like the N at all - and use R - and I also believe you now use the Humalog? I don't like this either - I feel it is too quick. So, there is another difference. You like pure dextrose powder - I use fructose, along with some other things - but definitely not dextrose.

    In addition, you recommend taking the insulin in the off-season, 3 times a day - 5 days a week. I completely disagree. I do agree with the 3x's a day - but not the 5 days a week. I believe in 1 day a week - or 2 at the absolute most - maybe once every third day.

    One more issue that we disagree on - maybe your thoughts have changed on this?? You recommended to take the GH in the morning or one hour after you take the insulin - I am completely on the other end of the spectrum on this. I do NOT mix the GH and the insulin at all. As well, I have been very clear on when I feel one should take the GH and I know a lot of athletes who have changed their thinking on the GH because of this. I'm not 100% sure on your beliefs of this anymore - maybe you changed - maybe you are the same - you would have to clarify that.

    As far as the guy you helped and gave 100,000.00 worth of info to, I believe we are speaking of Nasser??? He absolutely told me that you gave him the info on the insulin - however, I was also told that it cost him $2,500.00. I believe it was when you were living with Sonny S. at the time - and Nasser had loaned you money and then you gave him the information and that was supposed to cover the $2,500.00 - you can confirm this - this is just what I was told - banking that the 100,000.00 man is Nasser??

    As far as getting in an open discussion, there is actually a private area set up within this board. I could give whatever people I wanted passwords to log onto it and I'm sure we could get into some very interesting discussions. I think this would be a great idea, as I am always up to learn more.

    Hopefully, this has cleared up the entire insulin issue - you are right, this has been an ongoing situation for years - athletes coming up to me and telling me this and that - things you have said and it all in a round about way leads up to this.

    I wish the insulin was the only thing we needed to know to bring athletes in to the shows in top shape - unfortunately, at least in my contest preps, it is only a very small piece of the conditioning puzzle.

    As you can see, we do, in fact have many differences on how we utilize certain things. I can tell you that the first guy I spoke with that was a doctor - it was December - approx. 4 months before speaking with you - believe the show I spoke with you was in April - was the first person to bring up the 10 grams per unit and he did actually get this out of a medical journal and had the book with him. As well as literature that he had just brought back from a seminar in Bulgaria.

    Well, there is my side of everything. I still want you to know - I still like you and Milimar - just because we have our differences in our dietary theories, doesn't make a difference in how I feel about you as a person.

    Anytime you would like to have an open discussion with some of the other nutritionists you named - let me know - and I'll try to get it arranged - should be interesting and only great things could come of that.

    I honestly hope this is the end of the insulin debate - there's got to be something more interesting to talk about


    Milos:
    Thanks for telling me (us) your side.
    I apologize that I am taking this much space in your bulletin board, but I hope you would agree that I needed to explain couple of things upon reading your response.
    Dan Duchaine has NEVER talked to me about insulin or anything else for that matter.
    However, he got the fax that I have sent to Phillips and his response upon reading it was, that this just might work.
    Article in MM 2000 is mine, as you know exactly what I told you in Ottawa. And yes I was giving you notes, and YES as I have seen that you were much more interested in details than anyone else I talked to so I gave you more detailed info.
    Back than available insulins were N, R, U, L…and I did elaborate with you on first two and gave you my charts.
    I told you that N should be used only once daily and in theory R could and should be used 3 times, which I believe you accepted it.
    I NEVER said (it would be suicidecal) to anyone to use R 3 times a day, 5 times a week!
    When Humalog became available I implemented in my programs with many (not all) athletes and consider it excellent kind, for exact reasons you mention it –quickest action, which I find beneficial under certain conditions (immediately after the workouts).

    Discussing with you 1995 I never suggested dextrose (glucose) but talked about simple sugars. Dextrose became my choice with the use of Humalog (which I find ideal combo).
    You are right about me NOT suggesting fructose as for me doesn’t make much sense to take straight fructose, however I do suggest sucrose (disaharide consisted of both molecules –glucose and fructose).
    You are also right about my suggestions on GH use. Either one hour before first (or any meal) or two hours after the last (or any meal, if taken in multiple occasions throughout the day).
    And this approach I accepted from doctors who specialized on pharmacokinetic data with consideration of plasma half-life, clearance, hormonal interactions etc.
    Since than I talked to several other doctors that have different opinion, but I still did not change mine!

    You are right again as far as Nasser being the guy I talked about, but interestingly I would like to know where this $2500 payment come from?!
    Nasser if you are there would you like to explain this?

    And finally, I agree with you that insulin is only a part of contest preparation programs and even though VERY IMPORTANT PART, only a fraction of what contests prep requires. Only reason we are discussing it is because this was the only direct connection between us.
    I hope that now we have the story out, the way it happened.
    Chad, I always felt that you and Kim were sincerely friendly with my wife and me and I know that if you really thought that I spoke badly about you –you would confront me.
    I am very much impressed with the results that you REPETADLY achieve with numerous athletes. I take my hat of to you for creating so many Olympia titles.
    I would not be in New Orleans and even if I were I would not bother you, as I know how busy you would be.
    However, next time you are around I would love to invite both you and Kim for lunch/dinner!
    PS- I forgot one more thing, ten grams of carbs per unit is something I come up with back in 1994. I have never seen any Bulgarian or other studies showing that at this time. That was a puzzle that I was missing for a long time!
    Since than, I found in few books from Am. Diab. Aso. Recommendations by bodyweight ranging from 6 to 20 grams per IU.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Chad:

    Milos--

    Just wanted to say thanks for coming on and posting. I think together we cleared the air for everyone. I do want you to know that Duchaine actually did say that was his article in MM2000, however, I believe 100% that it was yours that it was pretty much word for word what we discussed.

    As far as Nasser, all I know is that he told me he loaned you $2,500.00 and you gave him the insulin info and that was the trade off -- you need to ask him.

    Yes, you did tell me glucose instead of dextrose - I just am aware that currentlly you are using dextrose. I myself, prefer fructose with a combination of a couple other things - obviously both ways work - so it's just different options for people.

    As far as Humalog - I believe the only time I would agree to take it would be directly after a workout in the off-season - if that is the only time you are using it fine. I was under the impression from your athletes that you use it all the time?? either way, no big deal.

    You don't need to consider me a competitor. I think there are a ton of athletes in the sport and plenty of room for all of us to do what we are doing. --And there are always going to be people in search of different options - that's one of the main reasons I put the board up - so I can give people the chance to get as much information as possible and come to their own conclusions from that. And I, myself, am always up for learning new things all the time.

    The only thing I wish you would look into would be different ways of taking the GH - not trying to change your mind but there are some improved theories out there that could help. When I get back, I'm going to post some info on it - as well one of my doctor friends is going to post some info on the subject. You can read it and if you think it will help - great, if not - in one ear and out the other.

    On another note - heard everything is going great with your gym. As well, I think your record speak for yourself - as I said, thought Craig was the best he had ever been, even though I am hoping all my athletes beat him this weekend Hopefully now we have put an end to this insulin fiasco and can get into some good, helpful discussions! However, I'm sure everyone enjoyed it.

  10. #29
    cuck jumal velho:n käyttäjäkuva
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    Milos:
    Chad, I always want to find new research and I can’t wait to see your input on GH.
    I would like to get involved in discussion about it, as I got so much info from numerous doctors that would claim very interesting things.

    Just to correct you – dextrose is just another name (synonym) for glucose.
    Fructose, that you use is quite different and personally I only use small amounts of it, as I believe it replenishes glycogen storage in the liver that has much smaller capacity than skeletal muscles.

    Also, as one of your board members mentioned it (supposedly one of the guys that was interested to hire me?) I did say that training twice a day and using post workout drink loaded with ANY simple carbohydrates could put that person in danger of becoming diabetic more so than if that person does use exogenous source of insulin.
    Rationale behind it – all those simple carbs taken daily and continuously would cause blood sugar levels to shoot up to high and to quick, requiring pancreas to release so much insulin regularly.
    So Swole (who are you?) if you thought I was out of line why didn’t you asked me that when we were having a conversation.
    What I do with my clients and friends is –I bore them to death trying to first educate them about every aspect of the program. I don’t feel comfortable just telling people to do what I told them INSTEAD I explain them WHY I think they should try what I suggest, and elaborate as long as I feel they need to really understand the subject.
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Milos:
    And it seems to me that I am confusing to many people with this glucose/sucrose/fructose thing.
    In my discussion with Chad years ago (1995) I told him about MY OPINION of kind (simple or complex) of carbohydrates that I recommend using with different insulins.
    I never really went into details of which kind of simple carbohydrates I would recommend –monomers or dimeric simple carbs.
    D-Glucose is Dextrose (same thing) and as a water soluble MONOsaccharide we can find it in sources like fruit, honey, maple sugar JUST LIKE D-fructose (same sources).
    Sucrose on another hand is disaccharide (molecule of glucose + molecule of fructose) and it is found in cane sugar, fruits, maple and beet sugars!
    There is a lot of specifics that I do not want to unnecessary write about .
    I realized that Chad is using different sources of carbohydrates and I respect that.
    Even more –I am curious WHY.
    I know that for example uptake of free fructose is considerably slower than uptake of fructose from sucrose.
    Also it is known fact that upon absorption into blood -almost all the fructose go to liver.
    Some of the glucose goes to liver but most of it goes to circulation (periphery) which causes high blood sugar that requires insulin release from pancreas.
    Insulin than does the job of glucose transport and uptake by our skeletal muscle cells (yes, I agree that excess glucose would be sent to adipose cells, but that is another story).

    I use many of the common foods that I believe Chad still uses.
    BTW apple pie filling is something I got it from him (unfortunately most of my friends do not like the taste!?!?), jams, dates…
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Milos
    I am ready and willing to be examined by leading diabetic experts about my theories.
    I have absolutely no problem hearing opinions against my program, like I said I am ready to defend it.

    However it looks like I am the only one ready to elaborate on specifics.
    You are diabetic yourself and you have to take specific insulin. Athletes do it for different reasons, as you know.

    From EVERY aspect I find Humalog safer and more effective (with the exception of carb loading days when I combine the two) than R or any other.

    At your statement that the pancreas does not cease to produce insulin just because insulin is taken exogenously – I have a question – did you monitor endogenous secretion of insulin after administration of humalog/ R/ N/ U/ L ?
    And if you did which feeding patterns did you use – (choice and amount of carbohydrates as well as proteins and according time of their intake).

    Besides WHAT does supraphysiological amount of circulating insulin could do to trained subject immediately after the grueling workout (when physiologic preference of their body dictates where the nutrients should be sent?). Assuming that subjects do have appropriate nutrients in adequate amounts. This is why I do recommend what I do!

    I did mention that I use sucrose in context that I agree with Chad on that one, not in sense that I prefer sucrose as a source. Simply I do use it sometimes.
    Your claim that you have much more effective sources of sugar to be taken with Humalog did get my attention. So, if you could be so kind maybe you can ask your sponsors to exchange some info with me. I promise they would not get disappointed.

    At the end, notion of excess intake of abundance of simple sugars (I am talking 2 times 200 grams daily, 5-6 days a week) being potentially dangerous (in absence of inject. insulin) –does comes from me.
    No scientific data, no research, no proof –only a common sense.
    Numerous doctors I consulted have the same response –they can’t prove it, but they would not put their family members on it!

    I am not proud to say that I contributed with insulin usage among athletes.
    But I am not afraid to admit that. When I started and even now –there is no accepted method that any medical practitioner would advise athletes how to correctly, safely and effectively use this potent anabolic agent!
    I started with my common sense approach, Chad continued and possibly modified it. To mention again he is VERY SUCCESFULL in what he does with it. I respect his innovative personality and I can only wish to learn something from him, or from anyone else for that matter.
    Your studies interest me; again for simple reason- I would like to see progress, improvement…and like always I would share new findings with everyone.

    I am never offended with negative comments about my program, but I would respect somebody’s opinion if he elaborates why he or she disagrees with mine !
    täältä pöllitty

  11. #30
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    Milos taisi kehitellä näitä teorioitaan lähinnä saadakseen myytyä kalliita treenijuomia.

  12. #31
    rautanyrkki:n käyttäjäkuva
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    Joo, kuka uskoo ton pellen juomii?
    Bullinki maksan meinas toi ukko paskoo, onneksi joku tajus fastilta tolle antaa fudut, muuten ois bulliki montus jo, DEAM

  13. #32
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  14. #33
    cuck jumal velho:n käyttäjäkuva
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  15. Peukutukset:


  16. #34

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    Diabetes

  17. #35
    Make72:n käyttäjäkuva
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    ^^Totahan pitää kokeilla!
    "Suomi teki maailmanhistoriaa omaamalla hallituksen, joka hajosi siihen, kun sitä vaadittiin noudattamaan omaa hallitusohjelmaansa."

  18. #36
    AK:n käyttäjäkuva
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    Minä olen jo vuosia ollut Milos Sarcevin reenijuomien säännöllinen käyttäjä.

  19. #37
    Hautaan asti Hullu inkkari:n käyttäjäkuva
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    Minulle (ja uskoisin kaikille normijampoille) aivan liikaa noissa Sarkeevin juomissa.
    A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough
    without ever having felt sorry for itself.

    I am the master of my fate. I am the captain of my soul.

  20. #38
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    Lainaa Alkuperäinen lähettäjä Hullu inkkari Lue viesti
    Minulle (ja uskoisin kaikille normijampoille) aivan liikaa noissa Sarkeevin juomissa.
    Tuossa aiemmin oli postattu kuva siitä, miten minulle kävi kun join Sarcevin treeni juoman.

    http://www.muskleforum.com/showthrea...l=1#post349724

    Sairaalaan siinä jouduttiin ja kyllä voin sanoa, että vitutti.

  21. #39
    Vierailija
    Mikä on tuossa kuvassa tuo ympyröity aines ruokien seassa?

  22. #40
    AINA OIKEASSA! wilbertti:n käyttäjäkuva
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    Minulla nyt testikehossa nämä. Kuolemaa innolla odottelen.
    Ei ole helppoa ei...

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